Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Your rosters, your strategies, advice, etc.
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Colonel Panic
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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Colonel Panic » 19 October 2012, 20:38

It is absolutely worth while to carry the ball with Ogres. Skills up your best players instead of the trash that'll die anyway.

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Poulpe2 » 20 November 2012, 10:17

Well, as a quite successful Ogre coach (in my last league, I went 6-4-4 and lost a few games due to abysmal die rolls whinch could have ended in a draw), I'll try to add my two cents.

1- The MM system is great for Ogre teams. Keep your TV low, and you won't see dozens of players with Tackle, which are your absolute nightmare. Kick your experienced snots out, unless they get a double or +1 AG. Don't get too much Ogres. 4 are enough. After two rolls without a significant XP gain, FIRE them too. Yeah, I know, it's hard. But you want to keep the TV really low. This is stupid, and counter intuitive, but, this is MM for you.

2- in a league, it's a different way of thinking. You want to have a full roster, with a lot of snotlings in the reserve box. You'll need them.

A few general rules apply :

1- Don't buy too much ogres. Having more than 4 on the board is a recipe for disaster. It's tempting, I know, but :
- You statistically have one key player each turn staring at little stars around his head and losing his TZ. Sometimes more.
- You'll end up not using your Ogres, keeping your RR for key actions (and with one each turn with no Block, you want to keep it). It sucks.
- Besides, 5 (or even 6) snotlings is not enough.

I usually play with 4 Ogres on the field, and I keep another one in reserve (in LEAGUE games, not MM !)

2- On offense :The most reliable way of scoring with snots is the swarm. Get the ball, run for the side with ALL your snots, and close one or two ogres near this. Then advance ! With 1/36 chance of missing a dodge, the opponent must create defensive walls with no gap, 5 squares from your lead snot. If he knows what's he's doing, he'll keep on blocking you till you can't score (which is quite soon with MV 5), whittling away your snots, and fouling your fallen ogres. With 7 snotlings, you have the "luxury of sacrifice".

You want to mix an ogre or two with your diminishing snot swarm. This way, your opponent has to defend in depth AND in line, because an Ogre can create a hole in any line, and the same ogre can instead send your snot ball carrier and score.

Throwing a snot is usually better used as a threat rather than an actual play, but I usually score a goal this way once every two games... and lose the ball in the same proportions.

3- Defense : not your strong point. You're slow and vulnerable to brutal reverse attacks, in depth or laterally. Your ogres will get swamped, your snots blitzed, and you won't keep a skilled player for scoring in a normal situation.

So, unless you see an opening (missed pickup or catch, double skull creating a gap, etc.), keep your snots far away, in a group, and let your opponent score. Make him score faster by grouping your ogres and hitting hard. Foul, if needed, to speed up the scoring.
Then, go for a one turn-TD. It usually involves a bit of luck, because you need a central kick off from your opponent, a freakish throwing scatter and good die rolls. But it can happen and, at worst, you lose a snotling. So, nothing to lose, in other words.

However, don't foul too much. Snotlings, especially at low TV, are not so easy to send off. 8 turns means 8 blitzes on them, so you want to keep the numbers of snots as high as possible. Believe me, 12 is not so much.

If you HAVE to actually defend, you have to be unorthodox. I once used three snots on the front line, kept the rest of the team in midfield, out of range from the opponent. This way, you'll have one chance to blitz your opponent cage or would-be catcher, putting players in contact with his ball carrier. It's the best you can hope...
Don't forget to choose carefully when a snotling falls. If he's not outed, you can put a barrier of bodies, just the way you want, and force your opponent to mix up his order of block/blitzes.

- Experience : in MM, it's quite simple, see above. In league, you may want to fire a snotling with no double or AG increase after two or three rolls. Beacuse inducements are good.
Skills are really a matter of taste, it's about the same experience pattern as Lizardmen team.

Ogres on normal rolls : Break Tackle is okay, but Guard is a must. Your snots will do Blocks, and you'll need the occasional +1. Other than these two skills... I want to keep them upright and controlled, so Frenzy or Pile on are out. Juggernaut may be okay...
on doubles : Block, of course. Pro is great too, a close second IMO.
STR : Block is better than 6 Strength. 6 strength > Pro.
AG : of course ! However, as a rule, I'm not much into Ogre ball carriers. Wasting a reroll for the whole turn, just to make my ball carrier move has always seemed risky to me. And I don't even take into account the actual pickup ! If you're lucky enough to get a +1 AG ogre, I say try it anyway ! And don't forget you can throw the ball too !
MV : on double 5, take Block, of course. And Pro. On a natural 10, I'd say that Guard is better than +1 MV, and Breat TAckle certainly is too. So, a good third choice (unless the guy is already AG 3 :) ) .

Pff... Simple rolls suck so much. I like speedy snots, so Sure feet is usually my choice. I love my occasional Catch, because it saves you a reroll when you go for a one turner, and it's great for surprise hand-offs (which you won't do often without Catch !).

Doubles: it may surprise you, but I usually take Guard. 1- it's really great in a snot swarm ! 2- it helps Ogres ! 3- Snotlings enter in loose cages like a heated knife in butter. 4- Guard + Sidestep is great. 5- The guy will die soon. Because your opponent hates him, sure, but mostly because, you know, hit the guard first. It's actually okay. This snot is costly in TV, and as he will NEVER get the ball (it's a rule !), that's one turn more for your ball carrier. Block is a nice second choice through.

+1 MV : take it, unless on a double. +1 AG, take it. The guy will die soon, because you won't be able to resist the temptation, and this snot will soon spend most of his time in the air, the hospital and ultimately, his very small grave. +1 STR... i'd rather have Guard and Block.

Random thoughts

- Wood elves are a pain in the ass. Really. They're worse than dwarves, because a wardancer can block your ball carrier in a swarm of snots without any difficulty. And she'll get out too. With the ball and the bodies of two snots, probably. Skaven suck too. All speedy team suck because your real weakness as an ogre coach is your MV. I'll take four dwarves team in a row instead of one wood elf team. Chaos Dwarves suck quite a bit too, because you may manage blockers OR Bulls but not both with your ogres... and Hobbos are awfully quick, compared to your snots.

- Frenzied players are good meat for you. You'll have losses, but your opponent too.

- Always stay close to the lines. If your opponent want to get there, a few snotblocks will send him out.

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby archdevil942 » 05 April 2013, 14:09

when it comes to ogres i find that one of the best things to do for your ogres early on is to get piling on for at least 1 player becouse an ogres team biggest threat (in my opinion) is the claw skill and the best way to deal with claw is to send that claw player to a grave
it also allows you to level up your ogres much faster

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ChrisDK » 06 April 2013, 00:30

Hello archdevil,

I will let you reconsider your statement - ignore my arrogance, seeing as you will learn a lot from my advice - PO is not a preferred skill due to your reasoing. Why ?? figure it out...

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Colonel Panic
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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Colonel Panic » 06 April 2013, 06:52

Piling On is incredible on at least a few Ogres. Ogres win by outnumbering their opponents. Piling On helps remove opponents from the field more than any other skill that an Ogre can take on a normal skill roll.

ChrisDK, maybe you should tell us what you think Ogres should take over PO instead of posting condescending replies?

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ChrisDK » 06 April 2013, 09:19

Guard - piling on shouldnt be added until a few ogres have been developed with guard and break tackle/stand firm.

I agree - my previous comment was shameful and I apologize for the wording.

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby archdevil942 » 06 April 2013, 10:48

i disagree that guard should be taken first becouse guard is a skill that allows u to outpower the oposition more effectively and considering that your ogres are already very powerful and that thanks to ur little guys they will not get ganged on so extra str is rly not that needed as your first ogre pick

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Colonel Panic
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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Colonel Panic » 06 April 2013, 18:56

Guard is really nice on Ogres for a couple reasons. It makes it a lot easier for other Ogres to get 3d blocks, which is great when you don't have Block. It makes it that much harder for anyone else to stand up to your Ogres. And it protects your snotlings to some extent; even turning 3d opposing blocks into 2d blocks is worth quite a bit in the long run.

Guard sucks on players with Piling On though, obviously. Go for a good selection of each instead of a cookie cutter build on each Ogre.

Disclaimer: Most of my experience is from scheduled leagues, not MM.

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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Rippys » 07 April 2013, 17:37

I've always gone for plenty of Pile On and an Ogre Ball carrier and think it works well.

An ogre with guard is going to be marked by a lineman, an Ogre with Pile On probably isn't - and if he is he'll probably de-pitch the lineman in a turn or 2 anyways. Sure Guard (my second choice) and Pile On aren't natural companions but Pile On is optional after all - you don't have to click it. And to be honest apart from Break Tackle there's nothing much else I like for Ogres in the Strength tree.

With the ball in the hands of an ogre in backfield with some snots to screen it's pretty safe. Leaving you to blitz, pile on and foul to try and get a numbers advantage similar to Khemri.
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Re: Ogre Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Blood Maven » 07 April 2013, 18:42

I have played well over 100 games with Ogres in various environments and taking Guard, Piling On and Break tackle are simply just the best skills you can have.

Guard is incredibly useful and helps in so many ways - from dealing with other Str5 and guard teams to protecting your snots.

Break Tackle keeps you flexible and mobile.

Piling on should be on ALL your Ogres and is one of the most important skills to load up on. Its optional but you should never pass up the opportunity to depitch the other team because its your only real chance of victory and you will be losing snots on most turns due to a blitz or failed dodge. The only way to survive is to win the numbers game.

You should play with at least 5 Ogres, if not 6. They are more reliable than would appear, altho you will have turns where 4 or 5 of the 6 fail but so what, thats the nature of the team. On overage you will have 1 fail per turn so with 6 you still get the chance to make 5 MB/PO blocks. Playing with only 4 Ogres is suicidal and is self-defeating.

In the end, a victory with Ogre teams is not about the end score, its about who has more skulls and red crosses in their box. :twisted:

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