Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Your rosters, your strategies, advice, etc.
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ghmongo
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Joined: 23 August 2011, 15:27
Location: Louisville, KY, USA

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ghmongo » 28 October 2011, 16:18

You definitely need a bench. AV9 is nice, but it means you can expect fewer armor breaks/injuries, not zero armor breaks/injuries.

Personally I'd go for a Lineman. I like giving Kick to Throwers, actually, leaving my 12th man to get something silly like Wrestle-Fend. (He actually makes for a really good Big Guy Bait.)

bowdy
Posts: 3
Joined: 25 August 2011, 12:28

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby bowdy » 29 October 2011, 12:37

I dont quite agree with the always block first for black orc.

Guard is a really good first skill for them as it make it harder to block agaisnt you and give you better blocking opportunity. And the unreliability is somewhat offset by having 4 block player already.
Personally Managarn, I go Block first. Guard isn't much good for a BoB who get's isolated, and block allows them to be used more proactively i.e. for Blitzs, allowing you to gain SPP quicker.

I'm not saying I wouldn't put guard on a BoB, but not before Block. Sometimes I prefer Mighty Blow before Gaurd as the 2nd skill. It can be a toss up depending on how my Blitzers and Troll are progressing. If I've rolled doubles and skipped getting guard on the Blitzers/Troll, I'll get guard on the BoBs. Same also if I'm in quite a bashy league.

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Managarn
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Joined: 02 October 2009, 05:26

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Managarn » 29 October 2011, 15:05

I dont quite agree with the always block first for black orc.

Guard is a really good first skill for them as it make it harder to block agaisnt you and give you better blocking opportunity. And the unreliability is somewhat offset by having 4 block player already.
Personally Managarn, I go Block first. Guard isn't much good for a BoB who get's isolated, and block allows them to be used more proactively i.e. for Blitzs, allowing you to gain SPP quicker.

I'm not saying I wouldn't put guard on a BoB, but not before Block. Sometimes I prefer Mighty Blow before Gaurd as the 2nd skill. It can be a toss up depending on how my Blitzers and Troll are progressing. If I've rolled doubles and skipped getting guard on the Blitzers/Troll, I'll get guard on the BoBs. Same also if I'm in quite a bashy league.
Then dont get him isolated? Guard is better as first skill than block offensively and defensively. Allow you to throw more 2dice block(in turn get you more spp imo) and prevent your opponent to actually throw reliable 2 dice block agaisnt you. Early on it wins game. In a league, winning is more importnant than gaining spp. And in MM it doesnt matter at what rate you gain SPP since its based off TV. Orc are the only team that can do it because they have 4 reliable player with block and a decent ballcarrier with surehand. Id do the same with other 4str characters but other team with high strenght are too unreliable with lack of block across the team or frenzy on said 4str player for norse.

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ghmongo
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Location: Louisville, KY, USA

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ghmongo » 29 October 2011, 16:24

Orc are the only team that can do it because they have 4 reliable player with block and a decent ballcarrier with surehand. Id do the same with other 4str characters but other team with high strenght are too unreliable with lack of block across the team or frenzy on said 4str player for norse.
I give Guard first to Chaos Warriors for the same reason and because the roster as a whole doesn't really have any leverage aside from those four ST4 players.

Ossie1972
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Joined: 13 October 2011, 15:06

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Ossie1972 » 29 October 2011, 19:59

I like giving Kick to Throwers, actually, leaving my 12th man to get something silly like Wrestle-Fend
+1. My 2nd Thrower always has Kick. Lineorcs make more sense on the surface, but the whole point of Lineorcs is to put them in harms way & soak up damage from opponents. Sometimes you want them on the LOS to protect your better players from Claw/MB/PO spammed superteams, which makes Kick unusable. Kick on a Lineorc won't get used half the time unless you have a deep bench with probably 3 or 4 Lineorcs & massive TV bloat. My 2nd Thrower is more a defensive guy who sits back to cover runaway BCs, and a reliable ball handler if we do get the TO, which is perfect for Kick.

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Colonel Panic
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Joined: 13 September 2011, 12:00

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Colonel Panic » 21 May 2012, 20:34

What defensive setups do people use against fast finesse teams? I like to set up forward enough to capitalize on a lucky break (a blitz, an early turnover, failing to pick up the ball, whatever) but far enough back that I can pressure or stop a deep threat. It seems tough to balance those two goals without spreading out my offense too much.

Right now I've been going for something like this:

Code: Select all

----|-------|---- ....|.OL.LO.|.... ....|.......|.... ..O.|.B.T.B.|.O.. .B..|.......|..B.
B = Blitzer
O = Black Orc
L = Lineman
T = Thrower

The theory behind this is, if I put the two Black Orcs on the line, the opposition will have at least a little trouble knocking down my defensive line, or at least they'll have to commit to doing so, so they should choose a sideline, take a risky blitz, and stretch out. In practice I've been getting burned more than I like. I've considered moving the entire secondary up a square to make it harder to get assists on the front line, but that seems to be too far forward. Thoughts? What's been successful for you guys?

Ossie1972
Posts: 34
Joined: 13 October 2011, 15:06

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Ossie1972 » 21 May 2012, 21:06

I like to set up forward enough to capitalize on a lucky break (a blitz, an early turnover, failing to pick up the ball, whatever) but far enough back that I can pressure or stop a deep threat
Otherwise known as "defence" :D

My philosophy for AG teams is: if they get the dice, they are going to score quickly anyway. But ignoring OTT situations, which are a different setup/thread, they are still going to need at least 2 turns to score. So I tend to play more defensively to minimise the quick score if possible. I have something like:

Code: Select all

----|-------|---- ....|....XBL|.... ....|.......|.... .O..|O.....O|..O. .B..|B.....T|..B.
B = Blitzer
O = Black Orc
L = Lineman
T = Thrower
X = Troll

Doesn't give them the sideline because with AG they can get a decent half-screen/cage all to easily. They are forced to go through the middle which makes it harder to cage/screen & gives all my slower orcs the best opportunity to come in & get involved. If I can bog them down in the middle this maximises the chance of a TO or some damage; if they play some elf-ball, get lucky & score anyway I'm no worse off, but I'm putting the pressure on to not stall so I get the ball with maximim time remaining. The offset LOS is a trick to force them to either commit more players to getting LOS hits than they would like (and putting those players near the sideline to provide the assists which keeps them out of the play), or even better to leave them alone & allow them to pressure the back of the screen/cage.

With slow orcs the chance of making any use of a Blitz against AG is negligible, even with Kick, so I don't tend to bother.

Ossie1972
Posts: 34
Joined: 13 October 2011, 15:06

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Ossie1972 » 21 May 2012, 21:09

I like to set up forward enough to capitalize on a lucky break (a blitz, an early turnover, failing to pick up the ball, whatever) but far enough back that I can pressure or stop a deep threat
Otherwise known as "defence" :D

My philosophy for AG teams is: if they get the dice, they are going to score quickly anyway. But ignoring OTT situations, which are a different setup/thread, they are still going to need at least 2 turns to score. So I tend to play more defensively to minimise the quick score if possible. I have something like:

Code: Select all

----|-------|---- ....|....XBL|.... ....|.......|.... .O..|O.....O|..O. .B..|B.....T|..B.
B = Blitzer
O = Black Orc
L = Lineman
T = Thrower
X = Troll

Doesn't give them the sideline because with AG they can get a decent half-screen/cage all too easily (forward guys come in 1 square obviously if they have Frenzy). They are forced to go through the middle which makes it harder to cage/screen & gives all my slower orcs the best opportunity to come in & get involved. If I can bog them down in the middle this maximises the chance of a TO or some damage; if they play some elf-ball, get lucky & score anyway I'm no worse off, but I'm putting the pressure on to not stall so I get the ball with maximim time remaining. The offset LOS is a trick to force them to either commit more players to getting LOS hits than they would like (and putting those players near the sideline to provide the assists, which keeps them out of the play), or even better to leave my LOS alone which allows me to get free & pressure the back of the screen/cage. It also allows you to hide a L1 BO without Block yet behind the offset LOS in a place where he is unlikely to be targeted. Having the Troll on the outside also minimises the chance of knocking them down 1 by 1.

With slow orcs the chance of making any use of a Blitz against AG is negligible, even with Kick, so I don't tend to bother, but this still gives you a chance of hitting a (probably) undefended high-value player if you get one.
Last edited by Ossie1972 on 22 May 2012, 20:53, edited 1 time in total.

Porkus_Maximus
Posts: 45
Joined: 22 July 2009, 14:30

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Porkus_Maximus » 22 May 2012, 17:03

Guard is better as first skill than block offensively and defensively.
2d without block still turns over 1/9, that's only marginally better than throwing 1d with the block skill. You shouldn't even need guard to get 2d on your BoBs unless you're against chaos/nurgle/orc 24/7, and in those situations you've got your blitzers to make "safe" 1d blocks to open up your 2d blocks.
This shows once more the kind of patronizing, selfrighteous, conformity slave, narrow minded nazi you are in the world of bloodbowl mate. On top of that that side note hijacks this originally nice anecodtal thread.

ChrisDK
Posts: 57
Joined: 21 August 2011, 23:45

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ChrisDK » 22 May 2012, 19:25

@Porkus
You are assuming that a block should always be made.

I completely agree with going guard first on BoBs and ESPECIALLY if you have started out with a troll.


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