Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Your rosters, your strategies, advice, etc.
Porkus_Maximus
Posts: 45
Joined: 22 July 2009, 14:30

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Porkus_Maximus » 23 May 2012, 00:04

@Porkus
You are assuming that a block should always be made.
He said guard first is best from both offensive AND defensive standpoint. Offensively it's highly questionable, and defensively your opponent can always block you -2d if they have block and you don't. The only times I'd go guard first on a BoB would be;

1. I absolutely NEED guard RIGHT NOW against a league opponent with lots of strength 4+ and/or more guard than me or.
2. It's a rookie BoB on a developed team, at this point giving the developed BoBs/Blitzers a guard assist in more important than making blocks himself.

Block is the no.1 skill for reducing risk of turnover and it's more reliable for keeping the BoB on his feet. Plus if you take block as a first skill you can have more freedom with your skill choices. Depending on the kind of opponents you face, guard is the kind of skill you can take 2nd, 3rd or even 4th. Block is the kind of skill that you really can't afford to leave until 31spp, especially not on a player that develops so slowly. I'm not saying guard first doesn't work because obviously it works for some people, but you're not helping your odds as much as you might think.
This shows once more the kind of patronizing, selfrighteous, conformity slave, narrow minded nazi you are in the world of bloodbowl mate. On top of that that side note hijacks this originally nice anecodtal thread.

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Colonel Panic
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Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Colonel Panic » 23 May 2012, 07:22

for the first skill on Black Orcs, it depends ... against other high-strength teams (other Orcs, Chaos, Nurgle, Khemri, sometimes Lizardmen, etc) the game commonly comes down to whoever wins the blocking war, and *that* often comes down to whoever has the most Guard. Throw Dwarves on that list too, just because they're one of the more guard-crazy teams out there. So if there are a lot of teams like that on your schedule, you want to get as much Guard as quickly as you can, which means taking Guard on Black Orcs for their first skill.

Against mostly ST3 opposition (all flavors of elves, Humans, Necros, Norse, Zons, etc, you can generally get 2d blocks whenever you want. Guard is still good but you can get away without it, and taking those 2d blocks with Black Orcs gets improved greatly if they have block. So if you already out-strength your schedule, you don't need Guard as much and it becomes much more worthwhile to take Block first.

If you're in MM and don't know your schedule, go with your personal preference. It's not like either Block or Guard are terrible skills, they're never going to actually hurt you. Maybe mix it up, give the first two who skill up Guard, the next two Block first. Black Orcs skill up slowly but they last a long time, so they ought to survive long enough to get both skills eventually. Or, in my experience, three of them will, and one will sit on five SPP for week after week, not getting any CAS while his brothers get stronger and stronger.

Porkus_Maximus
Posts: 45
Joined: 22 July 2009, 14:30

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Porkus_Maximus » 23 May 2012, 15:04

Or, in my experience, three of them will, and one will sit on five SPP for week after week, not getting any CAS while his brothers get stronger and stronger.
Har har har, don't we all know it. My record so far is a nurgle warrior who took 36 games. THIRTY SIX games to get 6spp.
This shows once more the kind of patronizing, selfrighteous, conformity slave, narrow minded nazi you are in the world of bloodbowl mate. On top of that that side note hijacks this originally nice anecodtal thread.

Makkiawiel
Posts: 51
Joined: 01 January 2012, 15:56

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby Makkiawiel » 18 August 2012, 13:19

Hello everybody,

I just got my Orc-Team running with a reasonable mixture of skill and want to discuss some development issues:
- The Troll. I started without one and am now asking myself if I should buy a Troll. Though he is grand roadblock, he also a bit unreliable plus you have to watch that he does not get isolated. He might be a plus in ST-heavy leagues but as Orcs already have 4 ST4-Players they re ST-wise only second to Khemri. So they do not desperately need extra ST. Or am I missing something? What do you think?
- The Linemen: I read some strategical advices - 1st is of course block (or wrestle) - but then? Kick is always nice, but you cant position your kicker on LoS, so I would have to field 4 Linos or would be forced to put Positionals on the LoS, which cuts the positionals potential in my opinion. Dirty Player is strongly advocated, but I personally think that fouling is too dangerous, even in big gangfouls. Tackle is always an idea, but is worthless against non-dodging teams. Fend is nice, too, but man, its an Orc Team and my linos are the ones to tie up the opponents and not the ones to get away from the opponents. I just came up with frenzy. Its nice for crowdsurfes and I think Frenzy is a skill that even works when you re not actually using it. The opponent always has to take into account that I have the possibility to frenzy one of his players into the crowd, which cuts his options.

What do you think?

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MattDakka
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Joined: 20 July 2009, 03:03

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby MattDakka » 18 August 2012, 13:45

Hello everybody,

I just got my Orc-Team running with a reasonable mixture of skill and want to discuss some development issues:
- The Troll. I started without one and am now asking myself if I should buy a Troll. Though he is grand roadblock, he also a bit unreliable plus you have to watch that he does not get isolated. He might be a plus in ST-heavy leagues but as Orcs already have 4 ST4-Players they re ST-wise only second to Khemri. So they do not desperately need extra ST. Or am I missing something? What do you think?
- The Linemen: I read some strategical advices - 1st is of course block (or wrestle) - but then? Kick is always nice, but you cant position your kicker on LoS, so I would have to field 4 Linos or would be forced to put Positionals on the LoS, which cuts the positionals potential in my opinion. Dirty Player is strongly advocated, but I personally think that fouling is too dangerous, even in big gangfouls. Tackle is always an idea, but is worthless against non-dodging teams. Fend is nice, too, but man, its an Orc Team and my linos are the ones to tie up the opponents and not the ones to get away from the opponents. I just came up with frenzy. Its nice for crowdsurfes and I think Frenzy is a skill that even works when you re not actually using it. The opponent always has to take into account that I have the possibility to frenzy one of his players into the crowd, which cuts his options.

What do you think?
-I'm currently playing Orcs in mm without a Troll (I had a Troll but fired him after some matches), because, as you said, he's unreliable and you need somebody near him due to Really Stupid. I think you can play well Orcs even without a Troll, you could try to play without him. In a private league, on the other hand, a Troll may be a good choice.
- For an Orc lineman: if you are at high TV I would go Block, Dirty Player or Block, Fend. If you are at low TV and you lack Tackle take it.
I don't like Frenzy on a MA 5 player, he's too slow for effective crowdsurfing.
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ShinyJ
Posts: 76
Joined: 19 August 2011, 18:58

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ShinyJ » 18 August 2012, 14:03

Hello, I don't play Orcs all that much, but my advice is as follows:

Troll - if you are in a MM environment don't bother, if its a private league get one so that one turn TDs by throwing Goblins are possible.

Linemen - Kick is nice on one yes, depending who you are playing you can put BOBs on Line of Scrimmage, as with 4ST and Gaurd they are a handful up there and with 9AV unless you are up against Claw you would be unlucky to lose one straight away.

As for what to take on your Linemen - assumung you have usual Block/Gaurd/Mighty Blow/Tackle builds on your BOBs and Blitzers I would say, take Block first then Tackle, on a double probably Gaurd as you can never have too much gaurd. Any stat up on a Lineman is obvioulsy good and should be taken.

Having said the above in a MM environment you probably shouldn't have too many Lineman - 4 BOBs, 4 Blitzers 1 or 2 Throwers and perhaps 3 Linemen. In a Private League obviously you may have more depending on team values and such.

Hope this helps,
ShinyJ

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ghmongo
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Joined: 23 August 2011, 15:27
Location: Louisville, KY, USA

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby ghmongo » 19 August 2012, 14:50

I don't know what benefit you get with two throwers as opposed to just one. The only reason I play with Throwers is because they start with Sure Hands and get normal access to Leader.

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MattDakka
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Joined: 20 July 2009, 03:03

Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby MattDakka » 19 August 2012, 17:30

I agree with ghmongo, 2 throwers are too many.
One is fine (and don't let you be fooled by the Pass skill, it's better to avoid the passing game with Orcs).
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dode74
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Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby dode74 » 19 August 2012, 18:27

I played with 2 throwers in OCC. One with Accurate, Strong Arm and KO return would sit at the back in the centre while the other would sit ahead of him. The rear one would pick up the ball and throw it to the other one (usually no more than a long pass, so 70% odds with a TRR) who could then advance to the LOS. This allowed me to form the cage right on the LOS which, for a slow cage-moving offence, is a big advantage as you are required to gain fewer squares per turn.
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MattDakka
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Re: Orc Tactics, Strategies and Builds

Postby MattDakka » 19 August 2012, 18:46

You can achieve that with one thrower passing the ball to a faster Blitzer.
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