New Matchmaking System

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VoodooMike
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby VoodooMike » 22 July 2016, 18:33

Why does my 2k+ human team always get matched vs 1k or 1.1k team when I have 2 or 3 teams around 1k at the same time in the matchmaking?
I don't think the matchmaking system is looking for the best match across all the teams you queue with, I think it looks for the best match with the LAST team you queued with, or the first... I don't queue with multiple teams, but you could figure out which one it is pretty quickly.
At the present time the MM can match you 1000 over or under your tv from next week and the release of the undead it will be reduce to 500tv +- and the spinning time should be extended from 3 min to 5min to find a better match . I m sure someone will correct me if i am wrong
Sounds right. The average TV difference is less than 250 already, even with that 1000 maximum. I'm not sure we're going to see a profound change to the TV differences under 500 max and 5 minutes, honestly. As long as people think it "feels" different in a positive way we should see a decrease in the concession rate, though.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.

TheBagdad
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby TheBagdad » 22 July 2016, 21:23

I don't think the matchmaking system is looking for the best match across all the teams you queue with, I think it looks for the best match with the LAST team you queued with, or the first... I don't queue with multiple teams, but you could figure out which one it is pretty quickly.
I've tried both options, first or last, it "always" match my human team somehow... I think it's a "bug", since some other times , it matches one of my other team.
The average TV difference is less than 250 already, even with that 1000 maximum.
I'm on ps4, I'm pretty sure average is more than 250. It's not rare I play a match with 700k+ difference... I was pretty happy to see that they decided to reduce it to 500k, I was on the edge to make that suggestion. ;)

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VoodooMike
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby VoodooMike » 24 July 2016, 02:24

I've tried both options, first or last, it "always" match my human team somehow... I think it's a "bug", since some other times , it matches one of my other team.
Was it the first team you made? It may be going on order of creation. Its possible that queuing with multiple teams is a cascading thing - if it can't find a match for one team, it looks for the next, and so on... rather than finding the most compatible match across all teams.
I'm on ps4, I'm pretty sure average is more than 250. It's not rare I play a match with 700k+ difference... I was pretty happy to see that they decided to reduce it to 500k, I was on the edge to make that suggestion. ;)
I hate to break it to you, but if most of your matches are 700+ difference, the 500+ maximum isn't going to fix that, it's just going to mean you won't be getting any matches at all most of the time. The distant matches were due to there being no better opponents available.

Now, if it IS a cascading system, and you have multiple teams of varying TV level, then it might work out for you. If its not, and for anyone who doesn't queue with multiple, diverse teams every time, it will end up with fewer matches played overall.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.

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Koadah
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby Koadah » 24 July 2016, 09:22

What percentage of 500+ TV gap matches are played to completion?

How many get past turn one?
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VoodooMike
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby VoodooMike » 24 July 2016, 20:39

What percentage of 500+ TV gap matches are played to completion?
35% of matches with a 500+ TV difference are completed... but contrast that with 43% completion rate for matches below 500 TV difference and it's not as big a drop as you might expect.
How many get past turn one?
This is a tough one since, as I understand it, Cyanide's data does not record the turn on which matches ended. When dode and I were discussing best methods for estimating certain things, we went with the 6-minute mark as best estimation of when turn 1 would have completed. If you can accept that definition then the figures he quoted were 72.5% (vs 86.1% for <500 diff).

So.. certainly high TV differences contribute to concessions, but they seem to be far from being the primary factor. What I don't know is relative availability of matches based on pooling times and TV difference. I'm not sure how dode calculated that originally, but maybe he can run those numbers based on the current 2 minute/1000 TV max parameters and contrast them with the proposed 5 minute/500 TV max parameters.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.

TheBagdad
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby TheBagdad » 01 August 2016, 20:05

It looks like you were right. Matchmaking always use the last team you added in the queue. (wich is kind of bad IMO.)

The game should allow a coach to have multiples teams independently searching for a match at the same time.

I hope they implement that in the future... :shock:

Itchen
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby Itchen » 03 August 2016, 11:26

Not sure that would work? As there is now a 5min 'Matching Period and all teams get their fixture at the same time at the end of that 5 min?

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dode74
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby dode74 » 03 August 2016, 11:56

Not sure that would work? As there is now a 5min 'Matching Period and all teams get their fixture at the same time at the end of that 5 min?
It's achievable. The problem takes a little more processing, but it works pretty much the same as FUMBBL does.
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Jorgen_CAB
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby Jorgen_CAB » 21 August 2016, 20:28

The matchmaking system is not a very good one.

If they instead would check on team development then matchmaking would much better resemble real physical league play for which the inducement system and game in general was designed and balanced for.

So, mainly comparing player levels as the first criteria and TV value as secondary and then win/loss ratio as last criteria would you get a decent system to match teams with each other.

Matching a team with ten played games to a team with 40+ games is not a fair game even if their respective TV are similar. Two teams with roughly the same player development will be more fair and then the inducement system will also work as intended.

Only my personal opinion though!

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VoodooMike
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Re: New Matchmaking System

Postby VoodooMike » 21 August 2016, 22:36

If they instead would check on team development then matchmaking would much better resemble real physical league play for which the inducement system and game in general was designed and balanced for.
TV is technically a measure of development, and that amounts to a worse system than what's in place according to the data. If you mean "games played" then the meta-analysis of data from four environments back in BB1 and on FUMBBL showed that to be even worse than TV.

The idea that the inducement system was "balanced" for anything is total hogwash. It was "balanced" for letting higher TV teams win more often than lower TV teams... deliberately.
Matching a team with ten played games to a team with 40+ games is not a fair game even if their respective TV are similar. Two teams with roughly the same player development will be more fair and then the inducement system will also work as intended.
The numbers say otherwise, and the inducement system already works as intended: badly.
Only my personal opinion though!
You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are NOT entitled to your own facts. You should think about which one of those things you're actually voicing here.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.


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