Improvements to the matchmaking

Share your ideas and Suggestions about Blood Bowl 2.
Kurgol
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Joined: 18 February 2016, 11:44

Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby Kurgol » 11 June 2017, 09:04

It has nothing to do in my belief that I can win, I complained about not having fun. The problem for me is that after all the matches with 1 team are down tv im not having any fun having my team killed by huge tv differences.

If you don't understand that, you're not playing on the ladder.

It's clear you have made your mind up, and that no-one else's experience matters to you - so I see little point continuing this discussion.

This is how it effects me.
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Phage
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Joined: 08 September 2016, 01:46

Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby Phage » 12 June 2017, 02:08

The problem is that the matchmaking formula equates skill to TV which is an entirely different measure. Even losing teams earn TV and right now young teams with a few wins are being matched against losing teams with higher TV. It should be based on record over games played as close as possible before taking into account TV. I sympathise because it is not fun to win for the price of dead players but that is the situation we are stuck with. This is not an attack on the choice some people make of bashing rather than playing the ball, rather a comment on how matchmaking would work ideally if looking at coach skill.

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VoodooMike
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Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby VoodooMike » 12 June 2017, 06:09

It has nothing to do in my belief that I can win, I complained about not having fun. The problem for me is that after all the matches with 1 team are down tv im not having any fun having my team killed by huge tv differences.
Awesome, but "fun" is subjective to the individual and thus, is not a useful measurement unless we have large-scale polling that includes people who AREN'T just showing up to complain. We don't have that. As for "killed by", if we're not talking wins/losses then we're talking player attrition. As it stands, long-term attrition is reduced by tvplus matching as compared to TV matching.

So, other than the subjective "fun" complaint, the rest are things that have actually gotten better, not worse, under the newer system. Not sure what else to tell you.
The problem is that the matchmaking formula equates skill to TV which is an entirely different measure.
Except that they're not. If one could not represent the other then we wouldn't see the rating being a superior predictor of match outcome than TV alone... meaning, matching under tvplus would not result in lower predictability of match outcome than matching on TV alone given that all the system does is "equate skill to TV", or more specifically, performance to TV.

Second, even base TV includes a performance-to-TV measure in Fan Factor.
Even losing teams earn TV and right now young teams with a few wins are being matched against losing teams with higher TV.
Under TVPlus matching the mean TV difference, and the standard deviation on that difference, decreased fairly substantially in COL. Be careful about assuming what you think would happen is what is actually happening.

In CCL young teams that don't start quite close to the beginning of the season are pretty much going to be facing higher TV teams consistently just based on how the ladder works.. It isn't full of constant team turnover like COL, it has a lot of new teams at the start of a season and then fewer and fewer as the season goes on, with more and more high development teams filling out the ranks... as we would expect.
I sympathise because it is not fun to win for the price of dead players but that is the situation we are stuck with.
That's a different topic altogether, really.. attrition is not a matchmaking thing. Under full TVPlus (that is to say, using all aspects of the idea not just the formula for matching) the environment is meant to be rez based, so you don't end up with dead players. The inequality of attrition is definitely an open environment issue that affects roster demographics, but expecting matchmaking to solve ALL the problems is asking a bit much.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.

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SirIronclad
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Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby SirIronclad » 12 June 2017, 06:55

Hey, guys! I think never implementing the BB2016 MVP rule would be a great way to make sure BB2 stays as fun as possible. I really enjoy having my Elves slaughtered by Clawpomb or mass fouling teams that don't care about winning. As we all know, that's what Champion Ladder is all about in the first place! Getting those 5 SPP on dead linos is what really keeps me going!

Oh, and please don't change the bank rule as well. It's the only way squishy agility teams are staying relevant, since the positionals on bash teams are far more expensive.

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CalciumCas
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Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby CalciumCas » 17 June 2017, 19:37

Hey, guys! I think never implementing the BB2016 MVP rule would be a great way to make sure BB2 stays as fun as possible. I really enjoy having my Elves slaughtered by Clawpomb or mass fouling teams that don't care about winning. As we all know, that's what Champion Ladder is all about in the first place! Getting those 5 SPP on dead linos is what really keeps me going!

Oh, and please don't change the bank rule as well. It's the only way squishy agility teams are staying relevant, since the positionals on bash teams are far more expensive.
Couldn't agree more. don't change it, it's fine.
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SirIronclad
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Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby SirIronclad » 18 June 2017, 08:23

Couldn't agree more. don't change it, it's fine.
LOL

wolle1301
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Re: Improvements to the matchmaking

Postby wolle1301 » 26 June 2017, 10:16

Restricting TV differences will either reduce the number of games played or increase waiting times. Neither is a desirable result.
As if waiting time wasn't long enough already :D

It should be worked on. Especially on smaller ladders. On the WB Ultra Ladder for example it is custom to first meet in the corresponding TeamSpeak and if you find somebody willing to play both players start searching for a match - nobody else searching there. It still often takes up to 5 minutes, 2-3 at least to "find" the other Team.

I dont't know which System is running in the Background, but for these small ladders it surely is not optimal.


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