This game cheats...

This is the zone for the ones who prefer to play against the machine.
thebrianp
Posts: 40
Joined: 08 October 2011, 11:29

Re: This game cheats...

Postby thebrianp » 16 February 2012, 19:58

I once killed 3 higher level AI players in 3 straight hits. I don't cheat, I am just luckier than the AI???

Yes once I failed 9 straight 50% rolls about a 1 in 512 chance. I guess I don't have any luck.



Actually I do cheat, all hail BBedit!

Dessad
Posts: 33
Joined: 05 October 2008, 19:57

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Dessad » 22 February 2012, 20:25

The best way to remove perceptual bias is to watch a match played entirely by the AI. Set up an exhibition match between two teams, slect AI controlled for both, and get some popcorn.

When you are no longer personally invested in the game, you will have a more objective perspective. While watching the AI play against itself you will see ridiculous streaks of both good luck and bad luck, and you may be forced to rethink your position. I think everyone should do this at least once; it's a good exercise in understanding some very basic flaws in human perception.

Mahida
Posts: 3
Joined: 20 September 2009, 14:56

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Mahida » 23 February 2012, 18:32

The best way to remove perceptual bias is to watch a match played entirely by the AI.
[...]
I think everyone should do this at least once; it's a good exercise in understanding some very basic flaws in human perception.
Good suggestion, I've never seen anyone else mention this.
Of course, you still have the problem that some of the players who complain are adrenaline-junkies who would get bored after watching 15 minutes of this...

User avatar
Darkson
Posts: 2713
Joined: 17 September 2008, 20:43
Location: Somewhere on the same planet as you.
Contact:

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Darkson » 23 February 2012, 21:16

Funny, another poster that thinks the AI cheats that disappears once they're proved wrong, or as in this case, that they can't even read the dice rolls correctly.
I wonder why that is? ;)
Galak 3:16 says "There is a point in time that a player really should read the rulebook."
Home of the ARBBL
TalkFantasyFootball admin - PM me if you need help.
Nope, I was talking about a 0TTD on a Blitz! using TTM.

User avatar
VoodooMike
Posts: 1614
Joined: 14 July 2009, 07:44
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Contact:

Re: This game cheats...

Postby VoodooMike » 24 February 2012, 20:06

The best way to remove perceptual bias is to watch a match played entirely by the AI. Set up an exhibition match between two teams, slect AI controlled for both, and get some popcorn.
Let me assure you that no amount of proof will satisfy most RNG haters - when presented with data that the rolls are coming out to the proper distribution across all games, using something like BBManager records, they've responded that only in AI games do the dice roll wrong. When presented with evidence that the dice rolls in AI games come out to even across a large number of games, they've responded that the AI somehow compensates for its cheating in order to make the distribution right. When presented with evidence that the code has been directly examined and there are no such routines in it they (and I kid you not on this) have responded that their copy of the game must be different.

So why even argue with them? Well, some of us hold on to the vague hope that for every vocal moron that can't let go of their ridiculously incorrect belief, there are 5 or 6 who are reading it and who will understand why the belief is wrong.

It's kind'v like the anti-smoking campaigns... they don't target the smokers, they target the kids who haven't made up their minds yet.
Friendly Reminder: Correlation does not equal Causation - tattoo it on the inside of your eyelids if it'll help.

User avatar
Darkson
Posts: 2713
Joined: 17 September 2008, 20:43
Location: Somewhere on the same planet as you.
Contact:

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Darkson » 24 February 2012, 20:37

It's kind'v like the anti-smoking campaigns... they don't target the smokers, they target the kids who haven't made up their minds yet.
Not in the UK - here they're all equal-opportunity targets. ;)
Galak 3:16 says "There is a point in time that a player really should read the rulebook."
Home of the ARBBL
TalkFantasyFootball admin - PM me if you need help.
Nope, I was talking about a 0TTD on a Blitz! using TTM.

User avatar
MILLANDSON
Posts: 1299
Joined: 06 November 2009, 12:11
Location: England
Contact:

Re: This game cheats...

Postby MILLANDSON » 25 February 2012, 01:48

The best way to remove perceptual bias is to watch a match played entirely by the AI. Set up an exhibition match between two teams, slect AI controlled for both, and get some popcorn.
Let me assure you that no amount of proof will satisfy most RNG haters - when presented with data that the rolls are coming out to the proper distribution across all games, using something like BBManager records, they've responded that only in AI games do the dice roll wrong. When presented with evidence that the dice rolls in AI games come out to even across a large number of games, they've responded that the AI somehow compensates for its cheating in order to make the distribution right. When presented with evidence that the code has been directly examined and there are no such routines in it they (and I kid you not on this) have responded that their copy of the game must be different.

So why even argue with them? Well, some of us hold on to the vague hope that for every vocal moron that can't let go of their ridiculously incorrect belief, there are 5 or 6 who are reading it and who will understand why the belief is wrong.

It's kind'v like the anti-smoking campaigns... they don't target the smokers, they target the kids who haven't made up their minds yet.
This I entirely agree with - we've had so many people posting on the forums, with all sorts of excuses as to why the AI cheats (coming up with a new excuse each time their current one is disproved), and refusing to actually believe the facts, that there is mostly no point arguing with them other than to try to show anyone else that might think there are problems/cheats that the dice are actually fine, and their belief was misguided, and so they won't post because they've been informed otherwise before they could do so.

We just see the people who decide that they can ignore the data because they don't think it applies to them, which given how these threads stay alive, sadly seems to be quite a few people.

If more people read and understood how the Mersenne twister RNG worked, how perceptual bias can influence what patterns you think you see, and actually listened to people like Mike, etc, who have proven that the game has no routines to alter the dice, or weight them towards the AI in any way, we'd have fewer people complaining.
Image

Image

Moderators do not represent Focus or Cyanide but do, when moderating, act on their behalf. Moderation posts and PMs will be in this colour.

Heff
Posts: 5
Joined: 14 December 2009, 19:13

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Heff » 19 April 2012, 16:37

Never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

Chaosnewguy
Posts: 8
Joined: 12 May 2012, 10:46

Re: This game cheats...

Postby Chaosnewguy » 12 May 2012, 11:10

Strange when i try and Dodge or pick up a ball with a dwarf blitzer, i fail most the time


yet for the AI, they can dodge and pick up the ball no problem 0_0

User avatar
MILLANDSON
Posts: 1299
Joined: 06 November 2009, 12:11
Location: England
Contact:

Re: This game cheats...

Postby MILLANDSON » 12 May 2012, 15:23

Strange when i try and Dodge or pick up a ball with a dwarf blitzer, i fail most the time


yet for the AI, they can dodge and pick up the ball no problem 0_0
It's called 'random dice rolls' and 'luck'.
Image

Image

Moderators do not represent Focus or Cyanide but do, when moderating, act on their behalf. Moderation posts and PMs will be in this colour.


Return to “You vs AI”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

cron